Idea Transcript
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Contents Untitled UV-FL Spectra PAH definition conflict Method of carcinogenity PAH can definitely contain heteroatoms or substituents PAH nomenclature and more Worth inclusion PAH definition conflict Illustrations for the PAH article Does not mention PAHs from over-cooked meat from BBQs etc Formation of Polycyclic Aromatic Hydrocarbons Polycyclic Aromatic Hydrocarbons Kekulene PAH Introduction Introduction Olimpicene Lede image Meaning of "Polycyclic" Will be editing Origins of Life section Move "Detection and optical properties" subsection to its own section? small change External links modified Proposed expansion of PAH sources, distribution, toxicity
Untitled I disagree. The material should be made consistent, but this should stand as a separate, more detailed article as per Wikipedia:Summary style. - Taxman Talk 14:36, July 30, 2005 (UTC)
UV-FL Spectra Does anyone know where to find the UV-vis and fluorescence spectra online? These would be very useful. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.247.199.50 (talk) 20:26, 12 July 2010 (UTC) Try looking at OMLC
PAH definition conflict The Polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbon is clear in defining that PAH have no hetero atoms and no substituents. NIST's >Sharov, Alexei A.; Gordon, Richard (28 March 2013). "Life Before Earth" (http://arxiv.org/ftp/arxiv/papers/1304/1304.3381.pdf) (PDF). arXiv. arXiv:1304.3381v1 (https://arxiv.org/abs/1304.3381v1) . Retrieved 16 April 2013.) - if so, then life may have begun somewhere in the universe billions of years before the earth was formed - and under conditions *entirely* different from that of the primitive earth - comments on this welcome of course - especially how this may be related to PAHs (more
Regression of genome complexity increase.
favorable? or less so?) and abiogenesis - (also, if interested, my NYT comment (http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/02/magazine/can-a-jellyfish-unlock-the-secret-of-immortality.html#per mid=105), also here (http://home.comcast.net/~drbogdan/images/SAVE-DB-Comment-20121202-NYT.jpg), may be related) - in any case - Enjoy! :) Drbogdan (talk) 18:47, 12 June 2014 (UTC)
This seems to be a good working team, and I would like to highlight that Dr Bogdan has worked on this subject in real life, and that he is the most gentle editor I have come across. Bogdan, are you OK with condensing the "Origins of Life" section in this article? I admit I am not very familiar with the PAH world hypothesis, but this discussion should be transferred there. Cheers, BatteryIncluded (talk) 00:05, 13 June 2014 (UTC) @BatteryIncluded - Thank you for your comments - they're *very* much appreciated - in some ways, I may be warming up to some of this at the moment *entirely* ok with me if anyone wishes to present some ideas of course - yes, I have some modest research/publication experience (http://home.comcast.net /~drbogdan/publications.html) (some years ago) with PAHs - mostly related to chemical carcinogenesis at the DNA level - but know there's much more to learn - Thanks again for your comments - and - Enjoy! :) Drbogdan (talk) 00:45, 13 June 2014 (UTC) STARTER DRAFT - A trimmed version (about 45% of the original text (https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Polycyclic_aromatic_hydrocarbon&oldid=612763959)/207vs462words (http://www.wordcounter.net/)) of the "Origins of life" section is as follows:
Origins of life PAHs may be abundant in the universe.[1][2][3] They seem to have been formed as early as a couple of billion years after the Big Bang, and are associated with new stars and exoplanets.[4] More than 20% of the carbon in the universe may be associated with PAHs.[4] PAHs are considered possible starting material for the earliest forms of life.[3][4] In 2004, astronomers, studying the Red Rectangle nebula, found spectral signatures of anthracene and pyrene, first time such complex molecules were found in outer space.[5][6] The astronomers suggested that PAHs originated in nebulae.[6] Other complex molecules, such as fullerenes that may also be associated with the formation of early life,[7] have also been detected in nebulae.[8] In 2012, scientists reported results that PAHs, subjected to interstellar medium (ISM) conditions, are transformed, through hydrogenation, oxygenation, and hydroxylation, to more complex organics—"a step along the path toward amino acids and nucleotides, the raw materials of proteins and DNA, respectively".[9][10] In 2013, detection of PAHs in the upper atmosphere of Titan, the largest moon of the planet Saturn, was reported by scientists.[11] In 2014, NASA announced a greatly upgraded database for tracking polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons (PAHs) in the universe.[4] References 1. Carey, Bjorn (October 18, 2005). "Life's Building Blocks 'Abundant in Space' " (http://www.space.com/1686-life-building-blocks-abundant-space.html). Space.com. Retrieved March 3, 2014. 2. Hudgins, Douglas M.; Bauschlicher,Jr, Charles W.; Allamandola, L. J. (October 10, 2005). "Variations in the Peak Position of the 6.2 µm Interstellar Emission Feature: A Tracer of N in the Interstellar Polycyclic Aromatic Hydrocarbon Population" (http://iopscience.iop.org/0004-637X/632/1/316/fulltext/). Astrophysical Journal. 632: 316–332. Retrieved March 3, 2014. 3. Allamandola, Louis et al. (April 13, 2011). "Cosmic Distribution of Chemical Complexity" (http://amesteam.arc.nasa.gov/Research/cosmic.html). NASA. Retrieved March 3, 2014. 4. Hoover, Rachel (21 February 2014). "Need to Track Organic Nano-Particles Across the Universe? NASA's Got an App for That" (http://www.nasa.gov/ames/need-to-track-organic-nano-particles-across-the-uni verse-nasas-got-an-app-for-that/). NASA. Retrieved 22 February 2014. 5. Battersby, S. (2004). "Space molecules point to organic origins" (http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn4552-space-molecules-point-to-organic-origins.html). New Scientist. Retrieved 2009-12-11. 6. Mulas, G.; Malloci, G.; Joblin, C.; Toublanc, D. (2006). "Estimated IR and phosphorescence emission fluxes for specific polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons in the Red Rectangle". Astronomy and Astrophysics. 446 (2): 537. arXiv:astro-ph/0509586 (https://arxiv.org/abs/astro-ph/0509586) . Bibcode:2006A&A...446..537M (http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/2006A&A...446..537M). doi:10.1051/00046361:20053738 (https://doi.org/10.1051%2F0004-6361%3A20053738). 7. Atkinson, Nancy (2010-10-27). "Buckyballs Could Be Plentiful in the Universe" (http://www.universetoday.com/76732/buckyballs-could-be-plentiful-in-the-universe). Universe Today. Retrieved 2010-10-28. 8. García-Hernández, D. A.; Manchado, A.; García-Lario, P.; Stanghellini, L.; Villaver, E.; Shaw, R. A.; Szczerba, R.; Perea-Calderón, J. V. (2010-10-28). "Formation Of Fullerenes In H-Containing Planatary Nebulae". The Astrophysical Journal Letters. 724 (1): L39–L43. arXiv:1009.4357 (https://arxiv.org/abs/1009.4357) . Bibcode:2010ApJ...724L..39G (http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/2010ApJ...724L..39G). doi:10.1088/2041-8205/724/1/L39 (https://doi.org/10.1088%2F2041-8205%2F724%2F1%2FL39). line feed character in |first1= at position 4 (help) 9. Staff (September 20, 2012). "NASA Cooks Up Icy Organics to Mimic Life's Origins" (http://www.space.com/17681-life-building-blocks-nasa-organic-molecules.html). Space.com. Retrieved September 22, 2012. 10. Gudipati, Murthy S.; Yang, Rui (September 1, 2012). "In-Situ Probing Of Radiation-Induced Processing Of Organics In Astrophysical Ice Analogs—Novel Laser Desorption Laser Ionization Time-Of-Flight Mass Spectroscopic Studies" (http://iopscience.iop.org/2041-8205/756/1/L24). The Astrophysical Journal Letters. 756 (1). Bibcode:2012ApJ...756L..24G (http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/2012ApJ...756L..24G). doi:10.1088/2041-8205/756/1/L24 (https://doi.org/10.1088%2F2041-8205%2F756%2F1%2FL24). Retrieved September 22, 2012. 11. López-Puertas, Manuel (June 6, 2013). "PAH's in Titan's Upper Atmosphere" (http://www.iaa.es/content/pahs-titans-upper-atmosphere). CSIC. Retrieved June 6, 2013.
Entirely ok with me to adj/ce/rm the version of course - hope this helps in some way - Enjoy! :) Drbogdan (talk) 13:34, 13 June 2014 (UTC)
From what I know about polynuclear aromatic hydrocarbons (PNAs), I strongly believe that there is only a very tenuous link between the origin of life and PNAs. The mention of transformation, oxygenation, and hydroxylation to derive amino acids, proteins, and nucleotides is almost laughable. PNAs would have to be broken down almost completely, then reacted with ammonia or an amine of some sort to arrive at most amino acids. Proteins are just chains of amino acids, most of which have no aromatic rings at all. The chemicals found in celestial objects include ammonia, water, carbon monoxide, hydrogen cyanide, and carbon dioxide - these are reasonable building blocks for amino acids, proteins, and nucleotides. The objection raised above, about the presence of water being a problem for biogenesis overlooks this: hydrolysis is reversible, and at equilibrium conditions, both reactants and products co-exist, even in water. My personal opinion is this: PNAs adsorbed to the surface of silicate particles (the latter also found in celestial objects) could very well have been catalysts (ie. more of a template and not a reactant) for the biogenetic reactions of NH3, H2O, CO, HCN, and CO2 to form life precursor chemicals. I think that the astro-professionals who think that PNAs, because they are complex, are life precursors, reveal an embarrassing ignorance of bio-organic chemistry. Keep in mind - the original Urey-Miller biogenesis experiments used these precursors: water, methane, carbon dioxide, and ammonia, with electrical discharges as the energy source. Amino acids were found in the product solution; subsequent experiments by other researchers found nucleotides, too. Keep this in mind the body synthesizes proteins and nucleotides in a thoroughly aqueous environment at body temperature, while PNAs are synthesized under oxygen-deficient hightemperature conditions, and tend to deposit on the surface of silicate dust (in celestial environments) or on soot (from incomplete combustion on earth). Drbillellis 19:52, 12 September 2014 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Drbillellis (talk • contribs)
Move "Detection and optical properties" subsection to its own section? The subsection on "Detection and optical properties" is listed within "Human health", but the content appears to be about analytical chemistry methods and physical properties of PAHs. I propose moving it outside of "Human health" to its own section. Does this seem reasonable? I'm happy to make the adjustment myself, but this page has a lot of active editors and I don't want to intervene inappropriately. -- E.Thorsos (talk) 04:43, 12 August 2014 (UTC)
small change stick more to the topic and should be more specific . — Preceding unsigned comment added by 106.51.141.67 (talk) 09:36, 9 August 2015 (UTC)
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Proposed expansion of PAH sources, distribution, toxicity In consultation with my colleagues whose research focuses on PAH carcinogenesis and ecotoxicity, I have drafted content that reorganizes and expands information about sources of PAHs, human exposure, health effects, and ecotoxicology. As I format references, etc., I have posted this draft to my sandbox. This update may be too detailed, and I welcome comments before posting. E.Thorsos (talk) 01:05, 3 February 2016 (UTC) Retrieved from "https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Polycyclic_aromatic_hydrocarbon&oldid=803088748"
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